Forums → Games → League of Legends

Just checked, last LoL thread is at least 2 weeks old. Ah well.

League of Legends is an okay game, I can't really vouch for them attempting to grow the professional scene right now because of some of the things they have in the game and that they add / change so much so fast but, yeah, it's great to play with friends (if you all know what you're doing or don't care) and I'd say it's more of a skill-requisite game than others.

The thing is it seems it takes 90% knowledge, 5% awareness and 5% coordination. I know I just mentioned skill but I'd have to call the best of the best the difference between:
1) Item Builds;
2) Champions picked and strategies involved (with the tactics obtaining it) and,
3) Coordination.

Aside from that the 90% knowledge is knowing what you can do with what champion, how dangerous you are to a specific champion, whether or not you can win in that situation and etc.

I play League an obscene amount each week, started late July 2011 I think.. Now I have almost all the champions(Missing 13) and 15 full runepages.

Hi. I've been playing around, or a fair bit below two years now. I have 3 full rune pages and 18 champions of 95. So, you've got 82, I've got 18.

Wow. You do play an obscene amount.

Did you purchase Riot Points, by any chance?

- H

The thing is it seems it takes 90% knowledge, 5% awareness and 5% coordination.

Now that I think about it, very true O.O

Did you purchase Riot Points, by any chance?

Yes :P Not having to pay for food/shelter/internet service/computer/gass/utilities Really adds up

Now that I think about it, very true O.O

^^ It's no surprise that there is a big learning curve -- it takes time to gain the intuition of different champion's power and knowing if yours can beat theirs, especially in the situation.

It's also an issue that I struggle dealing with more flexible elements as a result -- people with flat AP Runes, for example. The other is Summoner Abilities. . . it's quite annoying to know you can survive, if only barely, to be subjected to something that harms your healing so drastically -- especially if you Jungle as Warwick. Although, it doesn't make such a difference so that you can't kill the enemy, so it's usually an Eye for an Eye and that's a good thing if you die as Jungler -- it allows the laners to push.

It's things like this you always need to consider, whether or not you can get anything out of it especially. Of course, you want Wards, otherwise they will certainly fall short against their Jungler who will come to reinforce that lane, given the temporary loss of a member.

Yes :P Not having to pay for food/shelter/internet service/computer/gass/utilities Really adds up

Why don't you pay for those? xD
I don't either but I don't have income (I'm 15) so. . . quite tentative on buying Riot Points since I don't intend on playing League of Legends all that much.

I may put £20 up into it, that's around 3k Riot Points if I remember. I'd like to be able to get the 6 Page Rune Bundle, as well as a skin for Warwick, Rammus and Morgana (being as I already have two Skins for my beloved Jarvan IV).

I really don't know. T.T
We'll see how it goes being on Ranked, if I get high enough ELO being as I've started playing Ranked I may actually just invest in it, though I'd hate to deal with some of the flaws in especially higher level play. Critical Strike Chance and Towers being attributed the kills (which if you're dived and they die as a result, you took the damage and it doesn't make much sense to me) at. . . inexpedient times will infuriate me.

- H

Sorry for double post.

it was fun but I couldn't keep playing it because it takes very large amounts of time just to be able to play it.

It doesn't take a lot of time consumption, it takes more time accumulation. I know what champions do what and it's very easy to memorize somehow -- almost too easy.

You have to spend on average an hour a game

I believe the average is 30-45 minutes. It's not an absurd amount, in my opinion.

and in order to be good you have to literaly memorize each character and what their skills are,

I consider myself below decent, yet I'm capable of recalling pretty much every champion and their abilities, as well as most items in the game and their statistics.

I couldn't really name you all of them at once, you give me the name and I'll give you the things I'd be worried about and probably their abilities to some extent (the most visible ones, such as a charge, or a shield, a slow, etc).

which agian takes alot of time,

It's incredibly simple to learn it, but it does take a fair bit of time, I admit. You can watch Summoner Showcases to gain insight on each champion and what they can do.

plus I started to play it late and they're constantly adding new champions.

The addition of new champions is not only harmful to new players who may be put off by the superfluous amount of choice but the extraneous changes to the game that afflict egregious harm on the strategies viable and etc each day for a professional team.
You can't really let the game keep growing like this if you want it to have a strong professional scene, because the game actually doesn't grow to full depth with how champions could be used, as well as builds and compositions.

My primary example is the intricate game Starcraft 1 -- 12 years running, with the majority of them as Starcraft 1 being an eSport in Korea (as big as Football is in Europe, in comparison). There was severe imbalance in one of 6 matchups (at least) and only when one player of the bad end of the stick was able to revolutionize the play did the game actually seem poor for the other team.
Where it was I believe 25% Win Rate for the Zergs against Terran on two maps (Longinus II and another name, 'Longinus II' is also probably inaccurate), sAviOr (A Zerg player, of course) had an 87% Win Ratio.

You can read more about his exemplary play in an Article.

The point being -- 6 YEARS for that. League of Legends is incredibly young, but they shouldn't keep adding so much right now, I'd say you release things more like Expansion Packs -- with the size of Expansion Packs. The main issue is that a lot of Champions are deemed USELESS, and they're still adding more.

So the Expansion Packs can have betas, and will feature lots of theorycrafting and the pros especially can have a comment on it. At release, the metagame will still grow.

Also yes, the downloads can be a bit painful to bare.

- H

Why don't you pay for those? xD
I don't either but I don't have income (I'm 15) so. . . quite tentative on buying Riot Points since I don't intend on playing League of Legends all that much.

I'm only 14 :P, although I live in a rural area so when peope go on vacations they have a ton of pets for people to take care of so I charge $10 a visit and make ~2-$300 a month it's a pretty good income but it varies a lot per month (More people go on vacations during the summer )

The addition of new champions is not only harmful to new players who may be put off by the superfluous amount of choice but the extraneous changes to the game that afflict egregious harm on the strategies viable and etc each day for a professional team.
You can't really let the game keep growing like this if you want it to have a strong professional scene, because the game actually doesn't grow to full depth with how champions could be used, as well as builds and compositions.

I do agree with you that they shouldn't add so many more features, but if you look at it from Riots standpoint they probably get a ton of people spending $10 for RP to buy a new champion or skins.

I may put ã20 up into it, that's around 3k Riot Points if I remember. I'd like to be able to get the 6 Page Rune Bundle, as well as a skin for Warwick, Rammus and Morgana (being as I already have two Skins for my beloved Jarvan IV).

That Rune page bundle is, in my opinion, one of the BEST things to buy with RP (That and Champion packs if you don't own the champions) if you play draft pick it especially helps if you go top because you can run a full page of armour or MR depending on who your top against, when I play poppy and run a full armor page I start with arounr 90-100 armor and then the opposing person can not damage me very much. Even if they run a full armor pen page it only gives you 25 armor pen which is still no counter for 100 armor.

I believe the average is 30-45 minutes. It's not an absurd amount, in my opinion

Wow, my games go from an hour up with levels higher than 20 and less than an hour for lower. I don't get how you get such short games.

It's incredibly simple to learn it, but it does take a fair bit of time

Yea and some memory investment (my own memory) for a game that really isn't that good since its champions are imbalenced, and there's definatley a unbalence of Ranged>melee, I actually had an unfortunate game where all the players on my team were good, but all were using melee while the other team would have been really bad, but they all picked ranged, so all the ranged characters were able to keep us completly from advancing and it was quite annoying, they didn't even have to rush, just kept using stuns and shooting at us from behind a minion wave or turrets.

Wow, my games go from an hour up with levels higher than 20 and less than an hour for lower. I don't get how you get such short games.

It really depends, I've played over 1400 games. My shortest game was around 17-18 minutes and my longest game was an hour and 30 minutes long. My average game is around 35-40 minutes and when I play with some of my 2k elo friends(top .5%) the games usually take 30 minutes.

There's definatley a unbalence of Ranged>melee, I actually had an unfortunate game where all the players on my team were good, but all were using melee while the other team would have been really bad, but they all picked ranged, so all the ranged characters were able to keep us completely from advancing and it was quite annoying, they didn't even have to rush, just kept using stuns and shooting at us from behind a minion wave or turrets.

If you run the right team comp then you should have a ranged with a support bottom, an AP nuke mid, a bruiser(Usually melee)tanky person top, and a jungler. This way you can have up to 3 melee characters(Including the jungle) on your team and still easily win.

If you know how to play your character a lot of times a melee can beat a ranged character very easily.

vacations they have a ton of pets for people to take care of so I charge $10 a visit

You are very fortunate indeed.

I do agree with you that they shouldn't add so many more features, but if you look at it from Riots standpoint they probably get a ton of people spending $10 for RP to buy a new champion or skins

I think anyone willing to buy a champion is wanting to get their moneys worth. Unless they want skins and support Riot Games that much, they would play that champion until they hit 6,300 Influence Points, in time to purchase the next one.

It doesn't really seem like a solid business plan, although of course the need for new content is blatant. With that in mind, they're trying to cater to people who want to see new things (which they could very easily receive if they just watch professional play and let the metagame unfold) and professional players who want to play at maximum level, entertain others and obtain money.

Not introducing so much content is actually not a bad idea -- refine the observer's panel, refine the replay mechanics involved, basically patch up EVERYTHING that can be.

For instance, when you look at a champion on the LoL Client it doesn't tell you the exact numbers aside from the resource (mana / energy / fury / rage) cost. Not the damage, not the amount of time an effect lasts, or anything like that.

Then, add some more videos to show all of the effects of some abilities, and ESPECIALLY a clip of a professional player using this if possible.

That Rune page bundle is, in my opinion, one of the BEST things to buy with RP

Precisely. The thing is I'm only just properly starting to flesh out my Rune Pages as it is -- purchasing attack speed and scaling ability power (seals and glyphs respectively) right now, and I'm nearly finished.

Then I'm going for flat ability power seals, to help buff my early game Morgana furthermore.

This is the issue, what if I need it the other way round? It's more problematic. It costs a lot just to get all of this available and thus I can't really afford to try out new champions just yet.

However, with Rammus and Warwick jungling, Jarvan IV solo top and Morgana mid I'm fairly versatile -- however I'd like to know how to:
1) Solo top Mordekaiser
2) Ahri Mid
3) Shaco Jungle
4) Tryndamere AD Carry (I guess I can already do this)
5) Sona Support
6) Lulu Support
7) Soraka Support
8) Renekton Solo Top
9) Irelia Solo Top

. . . That's actually quite vast. I may also attempt Ryze. This would include build orders, skill attainment orders and intuition on a deeper agree.

Even if they run a full armor pen page it only gives you 25 armor pen which is still no counter for 100 armor.

How much flat armour do you obtain?

That and it's not better in the long run. I would rather use scaling Armour seals and in terms of my Jarvan Rune page, I currently have it:
1) Flat Armour Marks
2) Scaling Armour Seals
3) Scaling Magic Resistance Glyphs
4) Flat Magic Resistance Quintessences

This allows above-average defensive capabilities whilst allowing some flow for the late game. The effects best kick in during the mid game.

Wow, my games go from an hour up with levels higher than 20 and less than an hour for lower. I don't get how you get such short games.

That's the thing -- they're not short.

There could be a variety of problems. Maybe you're not aggressive enough. Maybe the skill difference is very precise, that could be the balance of the teams. Maybe your enemies were basically turtling.

If you're not aggressive enough it means you're not grasping opportunities. Often you can see the difference between taking opportunities and being greedy, but you should be able to obtain intuition on what you can and can't do eventually. It's quite basic actually -- you have wards being your eyes? You can at least attempt it. Is the enemy team dead? Go, fast.

In fact, a vast majority of my "skill increase" in League of Legends was just thinking of what you can and can't do -- this even includes the laning phase. Even if I'm 1v2 at top lane (because I solo top) I can still get creep farm (for the long run) with my ranged abilities (Q + E for Jarvan IV).

Yea and some memory investment (my own memory) for a game that really isn't that good since its champions are imbalenced,

I can't really say it's too too bad. Sure, a lot of champions are irrelevent but that's predictable considering there are. . . HOW many compositions? It comes to no surprise that only a few are discovered and it was obvious that others would be deemed completely useless.

Just go with the best ones. Then find the key in your build. For Jarvan IV (my most refined build) it is:

Regrowth Pendant + Health Potion > Philosopher's Stone + Heart of Gold (I return to base at 1,190 Gold to purchase these) > Mercury's Treads > Warmog's Armour > Atma's Impaler > Force of Nature > Sell Heart of Gold, purchase Sunfire Cape > Sell Philosopher's Stone, purchase Wit's End

Sunfire Cape was chosen above Frozen Mallet because the defensive statistics of +450 Health and +45 Armour was found more beneficial than +700 Health. My chasing / slowing capabilities are sufficient, so the slow for Frozen Mallet is extraneous, and the +34 Attack Damage granted by Frozen Mallet (+14 due to 2% of 700 Health) barely measures up against 35 Magic Damage AoE around myself -- being the tank and all.
Although you should theorycraft it a little more. At maximum my attack speed is 1.69. Times that by 34 and that's the actual damage increase, relative to Sunfire Cape.
Issue. Even if I'm just around two targets (preferably Champions) then 35 x 2 beats 34 x 1.69.

Oh! And it's still +9 Attack Damage from the +450 Health. The +45 Armour has shown to be FAR more beneficial.

there's definatley a unbalence of Ranged>melee

Not sure where you got that from. Many melee classes have abilities that let them very quickly close the distance between themselves and a ranged Champion. If you're AD Carry I believe being Tryndamere is the best -- his Ultimate Ability is just so powerful. If you're a tank, you're there to take damage, so if they run away and even attempt to kite you they're not dealing as much damage as they should since you have Armour and they're targetting someone who isn't there to deal the damage. They basically fall right into your hands doing that.

Sure, Ashe has a slow, Malzahar a strong suppression and Ryze an immbolization (as does Lux), but they hinder you temporarily, bar Malzahar's which is, fairly put, his Ultimate Attack. Much better used against someone who could deal immense damage.

Ashe also has a stun -- an Ultimate as well.

so all the ranged characters were able to keep us completly from advancing and it was quite annoying, they didn't even have to rush, just kept using stuns and shooting at us from behind a minion wave or turrets.

Poor composition vs Poor Composition, had they had a proper composition they should've won as well.

There are better forms of kiting and stuff. I don't know what champion composition they had but a good kiting one, or a ranged one in general that was used professionally was:
1) Kog'Maw, his slow and his artillery harass was brilliant and strong. The slow was essential in retreating.
2) Nidalee, her spears are supremely lethal, as well as her evasiveness thanks to her Cougar Form. She has heals for sustainability too.
3) Janna, her hurricane tossing knocked up the enemies -- allowing brilliant engagements, retreats or benefitting a snipe from either Kog'Maw or Nidalee.

Two others included, of which I cannot remember. However, that is a brilliant composition in how it was used -- they couldn't land an engagement, especially since they also had Flash to back off with.

- H

How much flat armour do you obtain?

This is what I do:
Seals: Flat armor
Glyphs: Flat armor
Marks: Flat AD
Quints: Flat armor(I'm missing 2 of these >_&lt

This gives me +31 armor and +9 AD (I usually play poppy with this setup so I press w and get about 100 armor)
Mid game game as poppy I usually have tri force and maybe a glacial shroud along with a Philo stone.

In blind pick I go flat AD marks and quints flat armor seals and flat MR glyphs.
This is aimed at getting the most farm early I possibly can

1) Kog'Maw, his slow and his artillery harass was brilliant and strong. The slow was essential in retreating.
2) Nidalee, her spears are supremely lethal, as well as her evasiveness thanks to her Cougar Form. She has heals for sustainability too.
3) Janna, her hurricane tossing knocked up the enemies -- allowing brilliant engagements, retreats or benefitting a snipe from either Kog'Maw or Nidalee.

If you look at this with kog's range, if this is a good team kog will get a heal from nidalee giving him +60% attack speed(I think it's somewhere around there) and Janna's shield giving him around +40 AD(Somewhere around there?)

Couldn't look at the rest of the post much right now
Maybe I'll look over the rest of it later :P
You just turn Kog into a living death machine.

This gives me +31 armor and +9 AD (I usually play poppy with this setup so I press w and get about 100 armor)

Hrmm, not bad but consider that scaling Armour Seals alone gives you 27+ Armour. . . that's nearly all of that you dedicated over the course of the game using effectively 25% as opposed to 75%.

As you said you get a Philosopher's Stone I feel this could be more effective for you -- just open with a Regrowth Pendant and it should be enough longevity. With that in mind, you're not as mobile or have long range abilities in order to kill creep so you would need to take more damage.

Open up with Philo Stone for the Gold Per 5 benefit as well.

This is aimed at getting the most farm early I possibly can

There's an issue. The difference with and without runes would not be significant enough to make a difference between Poppy and a superior Champion. Of course it's blind pick and thus no choice but in terms of Solo Top I've found Mordekaiser unparalelled. I really want to learn how to play Mordekaiser as a result.

- H

Hrmm, not bad but consider that scaling Armour Seals alone gives you 27+ Armour. . . that's nearly all of that you dedicated over the course of the game using effectively 25% as opposed to 75%.

It's only early game when I need the armor though, when I hit 18 I usually have a glacial shroud and maybe a frozen heart giving me a ton of armor, and when I use my ult it only allows one person harm me at all giving me almost free range(If I use it on their support) for about 5 seconds(I think).

just open with a Regrowth Pendant and it should be enough longevity.

I start with this if I use my alternate MR runepage and I do that if I'm soloing against a mord, vlad, ect.

If not I start with cloth armor and 5 health potions for the extra armor and ability to stay in lane.

My first back I ALWAYS buy a Philo stone and maybe boots if I have enough money after buying wards/more health potions

There's an issue. The difference with and without runes would not be significant enough to make a difference between Poppy and a superior Champion.

But without my runes I lose 30 armor, if I do have my runes and I'm soloing against say a nidalee she will auto-attack me 2-3 times every time I kill a creep. With runes she will do 90 less damage to me(About 60-80 damage total) Without runes she'll do about 150-170 damage. This allows me to use my health potions less but still keep around 90-100% HP.

I've found Mordekaiser unparalelled.

Mordekaiser can be beaten very easily, usually a mord will push to your tower allowing for an easy gank from your jungler. If you jungler has any idea what they're doing you will probably get a level 1 gank pushing mord out of lane. In turn if you know what your doing mord will have already pushed the lane so you will completely zone him out and easily win your lane.

If your jungler doesn't know what he's doing, you'll just have to have picked a champion that can beat mord like Irelia, Kennen, Nidalee, ect.

Although, if neither of these situations occurred, good luck Jim.


If you want a champion that can win almost any lane, play Yorick